Mike76

I've only had it for a few months, and indeed, even for me (despite already having "Entertainment!") it's a work that requires more listens to be "understood." So I won’t give it a rating yet, but right now it would be a 4.5. You're right to say it's funkier than its predecessor, but I'd also say it's less punk because the sound is less harsh and more polished, and the vocals sometimes try to be melodic, while at times, as in the case of "Paralysed," they're cold, almost "robotic." Anyone who considers "Blood Sugar Sex Magic" the best Funk-Rock album in history should definitely give this a listen.

"nothing to do with the desperate rock of Joy Division or with the experimental Pop Group and Pere Ubu." Yes, and from the little I know of them (only 2 tracks), I would say they have nothing to do with New Wave, but joking aside, listening to "Another Girl, Another Planet" and "Miles from Nowhere" didn't make me want to look for anything else by them: too close to traditional rock for my taste.

I don't know Cohen and Drake well enough to say you picked the right example, but yes, my way of evaluating an album is more or less as you say, Lux. I pay a lot of attention to innovation, although it's true that ignorance can make me perceive an album as innovative even when it’s not. I should add that this perspective doesn't lead me to discard "everything that isn't innovative"; subjective pleasure in listening still carries weight. That's why I might enjoy entertainment albums that I don't find entirely predictable (like the first two Duran albums, just to give a simple example). As for NIN, it seems to me that their proposal boils down (as in the case of "Head Like A Hole") to a compromise between classic and banal rock song (though I'd say more hard-pop given the ostentatiousness of the chorus) and an industrial-EBM sound that, even at the time, could no longer be considered innovative (at best "fresh"). Thus, listening to them doesn’t bring me pleasure/fun for the listening experience itself, nor admiration for having created something original. For me, "objective innovation" is a consequence of "the artist's personal interpretation."

Many give this album a 5, and the same rating applies to me, although it’s probably not the same 5 that others give. More than the pleasure of listening itself, this is an album too important and influential to rate any lower. However, I do agree with those who say it deserves a 5 mainly for the title track, which is the only one that transcends the song format and manages not to bore, despite its ten-minute length, thanks to one of the most brilliant call-and-response interactions between bass and guitar ever, along with truly astonishing virtuosity (like the guitar imitating birdsong). Technique and creativity: it has it all. However, the other tracks excite me only at times; they don’t feature particularly interesting writing, and some still showcase those typical old-school rock and roll solos that I personally find a bit hard to digest. The final part often risks coming off as overly sentimental (“Prove It” even steals its opening from “Stand By Me” and the “Pregherò” by Celentano, just to give an idea). If it weren't for the track "Marquee Moon," it would be just a 3.5 album for me. The full five is also achieved thanks to the superb "Little Johny Jewel" included in the reissue.

I haven't seen it, but just the idea of following up on Inferno...

I've never been to China either, but I like the album: exoticism that isn't tacky and originality are a rare commodity.

I find the Red Hot as characters quite likable, but their music has never particularly grabbed me, starting with the soul and rap inflections in the singing that, when not tedious, leave me indifferent at best. Musically, I also find them far from irresistible; with their bland and cool-alternative funk-rock, they really come off poorly compared to the early albums of masters like A Certain Ratio or Gang Of Four, who used funk to create music that was less tricky and more innovative than theirs. I listened to this album many years ago, but I remember really struggling to get to the end. Endless. Like this review.

"Most of the musicians in Manchester were very well-educated and petit bourgeois, like Howard Devoto. Barney (Sumner) and I were essentially working-class types. Ian was halfway in between, but ultimately our attitude was different. We felt like outsiders surrounded by malignity and gossip." PETER HOOK

An example of Curtis's "racism" brought out by his wife Deborah is when he recounted at the pub a story about an Indian family that, to have an extra room, gave up their bathroom. When the moment arose, they would defecate on newspaper, ball it up, and throw it into the neighbors' garden. If criticizing something like this is "racism," then Mrs. Deborah Curtis is nothing short of a fool.

Then Ian Curtis could very well vote conservative (which isn’t an insult) but he certainly wasn’t the neo-Nazi you’re trying to portray.