ngw

Read carefully, I haven’t denied the progressive influences, but those of shoegaze. And if I have a narrow view of shoegaze, yours is certainly too inclusive. If distortion + dreamy atmosphere gives me shoegaze (and I didn’t say they were missing in MC, but did you read what I wrote?), then the Cocteau Twins make shoegaze, the Sonic Youth of Evol make shoegaze; in short, in the last 20 years, *hundreds and hundreds* of bands have made shoegaze. Your argument, in my opinion, is like saying "look at this angry text, Fuck You, they are inspired by the hardcore of Minor Threat," as if just taking a couple of characteristics—by the way, ones that can be found in a plethora of bands—justifies influences. As for the rest, thanks a lot, who hasn’t taken shoegaze sounds in the '90s? Shoegazing also means a nearly non-existent rhythm section, characteristic of the shoegaze "sound"; do you see that in the Smashing Pumpkins? Otherwise, we could say that all punk bands are inspired by the sound of the Sex Pistols, which is far from true, but it is true that everyone takes a generic "something" from them. And if Corgan doesn’t care to group himself with and cite the MBV, how come he doesn’t mention much more obvious but certainly less noble influences, like the Stooges, who are far less alternative, not to mention Jane's Addiction? Bullet... which is a more pop Pixies song? The mix of Depeche Mode/Pet Shop Boys/New Order in Adore? I repeat, it sounds cool to bring up the MBV for anyone; shoegaze is one of the minor influences for the SP, they take a bit of sound without taking the truly revolutionary component, very easy that way. Anyway, I wouldn’t want to give the impression that this album is crap for me; as I’ve already said, it’s a good album, definitely worth what it costs. But from here to being a masterpiece of abyss, there are at least a dozen, at least for me.

I'm not shooting you down, but I must point out that you couldn't have found two more different records... :)

Ah, was it that? So the definitive answer is "I'm stupid"? No, because taking one of my phrases and adding the part about seminalness is stupid, as well as reasonably dishonest. Congratulations, I really didn't think there were "fans" as hilarious as those of Vasco Rossi. You are epic and seminal, seriously.

"epic" for the lows, "seminal", fuck off :D

Frankly, it’s not clear where you’ve seen the connection between epic and seminal; it probably stems from a superficial reading of what I wrote and a not-so-great knowledge of the Italian language. Or maybe it’s just from the inability to counter a single objection, leading you to cling to objectively invented nonsense that I didn’t write at all. Clarifications are welcome; from my comment, even a junkie monkey high on heroin would have understood that I question the ethical term for the lows (after all, it's written in your mother tongue, right?), and I don't associate it at all with "epic." It’s still nice to see that it takes just two quick comments to throw you into a complete crisis, to the point where you invent bullshit out of thin air just to attack me.

Easy, if Cremonini says that there’s a shadow of progressive in his music, that doesn’t mean it’s true, also because honestly bringing up My Bloody Valentine is a pretty nice trend, just like all those mediocre vocalists citing the Cocteau Twins. Where are these dreamy atmospheres accompanied by distortions? Porcelina? Who knows. As usual, opinions, I repeat and will repeat to exhaustion that shoegaze is music that is extremely well-defined, it’s not like some wannabe comes along and claims to do shoegaze just because they use distortions (otherwise, the SY would do shoegaze too). Slowdive, Shellac do shoegaze. Anyway, you’re right, they’re just opinions, to me a flop is a flop, and a piece of crap is a piece of crap, it’s not "the desire to bring out the absolute masterpiece," just as an horrendously stereotyped lyric like that of Tonight Tonight is anything but pretentious, assuming the pretense isn’t to end up on MTV talking to the "VJ" striking some half-baked alternative pose. It’s still what I said from the first comment, they’ve taken a bigger step than their leg can handle.

Indeed, after 11 years the price of the record has *increased*. It’s hard to believe how low the "fans" can go.

Yes, I'm an idiot, I wanted to give 2 to the review and 3 to the album. I messed up.

ringhiostarr, I reason and discuss, you snicker and fidget for no apparent reason, mocking me because I expressed an opinion about an album. If I gave any weight to the little brats insulting online, I would find your behavior, besides being idiotic, offensive. Thank God it's not the case, and I give the little kids the weight they deserve :) So feel free to continue; I have no time to waste, but apparently, you enjoy talking to yourself. Just for the record, the album is still at full price on Amazon ($20.99), Nannucci (28 euros, half off), Disfu (26 euros), play (13 pounds), so tell "everyone" and various cousins that Corgan may have found a way to promote himself for free, but he could also give a heads up to the distributors, because then the screaming fans looking for autographs end up making fools of themselves, like in your case.
I appreciate, as always, easy's contribution, with whom I find myself discussing every day, and thankfully doesn't play the role of the whiny unicellular but talks about music, without bringing out banners of any kind. For some things, I agree: certainly a classic, but forgive me, leave the epic and grandiose for other albums that are certainly more deserving; it's not like the album's scope automatically makes it "epic" and "grand." There are lows, and I don't think anyone has denied that. Lows bordering on embarrassment, like Tonight Tonight which ended up in heavy rotation on MTV (hypothetically), an ultra-cheesy meatball complete with strings, a tale of a girl and revenge, a true novelty. I see the bands that weren't lucky enough to churn out classics in the '90s toiling over at least 7-8 tracks on a double: End Hits, Geek the Girl, Loveless, Bee Thousand, and some other ton of albums I don't feel like naming, truly seminal and truly "epic" and "grand" (and different). And coincidentally, the more time passes, the more Mellon Collie annoys me (after a fling when it was released), the more I appreciate Adore and especially Siamese Dream, coincidentally single albums, coincidentally much more homogeneous and consistent. Cite the truly beautiful tracks from SD, then those from MC, without the nonsense of "they're all beautiful," and then let's see if they had the material for a double. And I asked what they added to the music; I didn't ask why you liked it; I gave it a 3, which in my house is at least a 7. There isn't a trace of shoegazing; as usual, it just takes a crappy effect to pull out shoegaze, which here fits in as well as no wave fits with Celentano's music. What you’re telling me, in simple words, is that it's remasticated wave for that decade, with an "indie" attitude that is objectively nonexistent (the arrangements very indie, yes, just a bit more and they would have called the philharmonic). If this is a masterpiece ...

And this album continues to be the third. Have you ever heard of the Smashing Pumpkins? I have a feeling you haven't.