antoniodeste

Harsh words have flown! Especially at the beginning. From my point of view, the use of the term "pirla" could probably have been avoided; as I see it, its value has truly diminished these days, if understood as a genuine form of insult. I didn't understand, however, the motivations of the "carillon" that, after strenuously clinging to an ethical claim in a rather tedious way ("you shouldn't have said that!!" or similar...), miserably ended up in the wrong this time, indeed, offending the angry interlocutor with a decidedly heavy term, who can only emerge victorious from a not-so-easy contest. Personally, I wasn't bothered by the inaccuracies and somewhat foolish evaluations of the Carillon. I've always liked Cream, and if he wants to give them toilet paper or packing paper instead of gold records, that's his business. "Disraeli Gears" or "Wheels Of Fire" are truly important chapters, and what worries me is that people lacking competence in the matter might spread information, descriptions, and yes, let’s say it, unfair reviews that are historically inaccurate and perhaps even of dubious taste. Note to puntiniCAZpuntini: you’re a dear guy, and it’s clear from the vitality you express; whether you’re gay or not doesn’t matter to me, BUT (and I say this as someone with a VERY long tongue) don’t waste your "keyboard" talent on people who don’t deserve it; direct your overflowing energy toward causes and people more worthy. Yes, okay, Cream is more than deserving, but I’ve read you elsewhere (always with pleasure) and you seem like someone who seeks conflict, and sooner or later, you might find someone who loves it more than you do. (And maybe you’d even like that... hee hee hee) Peace, Love & Freedom (directly from the Woodstock generation)

The pleasure, Jop, is truly mutual. I've never been very intrigued by orthodox "singer-songwriter" styles, although, as already understood, Pink Moon and Five Leaves Left accompanied much of my adolescent-youth. (Am I still young? Who knows...). But tell me: did you also listen to (or do you listen to) John Martyn or Bruce Cockburn?
Good Vibrations! :)

Guys, let me tell you that, after reading ALL the comments (after mine), I literally exploded in big, loud, genuine laughter. I felt like a fool laughing alone in front of a monitor. Worse than THX and so on by Giorgino Lucas. Forget about skirmishes between Geesin and the orchestral musicians! They are laying the groundwork for the new online comedy for the times to come! I mean, I could watch all the pseudo-comedic shows from the most absurd TV networks and never laugh as much or as genuinely as I did during the cultured exchanges of the protagonists: EneatheDevil first and foremost (score: 1000) Caz or Cazz or whatever the heck his name is: Fantastic (Score: 1000 - ex-aequo) and Easycure: brilliant - score: 999. Honestly, I would have never imagined from the depths of my closed-mindedness to start from Roger Waters and rise up, up, always up to the Kinder or to the beloved Oransoda. I haven't followed such hilarious issues of cultured pataphysics for a long time, but the mentioned subjects have rejuvenated this voluptuous pleasure. Thanks for that. Now, however, I want to add my two cents on the more "serious" side: I think it’s really a bit exaggerated to take an ideal axe and chop up the poor Waters’ career over a pre or post 72 or 74 or blah blah issue. There are purists and "hardliners" like me who love the early Floyd, and others, like me (.....) who also appreciate the "post Darkside." It’s a matter of mental setup, tastes, cultural climates, mental openness, types of ears provided by nature (more or less big, floppy, protruding forward, well-shaped etc.) and also of things like "what do I want to hear in this Pink Floyd album, and if it's not there, I get angry," in other words, a matter of preconceptions. When I listen to "Careful," "A Saucerful...," "Arnold Layne," "Interstellar Overdrive," I have certain feelings and vibrations; whereas when I listen to "Us & Them" or "The Great Gig In the Sky," I experience others. I don’t know if they’re better or worse, just different. It's solely based on my personal emotional and affectionate background that the experience shifts to this or that level; and in the context of a discussion on a forum, I think it’s absolutely irrelevant and useless to try to impose with cultured and thorough justifications what I like. Is it clear what I mean? So, it's pretty ridiculous to be here debating whether Waters is better than your father playing a flute carved from a pumpkin. Waters gave what he could give, and I think he did so, at least for a while, in dignified good faith and with the necessary effort, creativity, and imagination. His three partners probably did the same. Then, and it’s inevitable to say it, he had a noticeable decline in quality that often produced somewhat muddled things because, poor guy, he’s CONFUSED; and given the childhood he had, it's already a great achievement that he hasn't ended up like Syd Barrett. Now, as a worn-out sixty-year-old, he tries to do some "crazy stuff" because: 1) he feels like doing it, 2) he has a lot of fun doing it, 3) he has nothing better to do, 4) he keeps himself "visible," and 5) maybe he manages to fund his little vices, if he has any. I reiterate that I haven’t yet had the pleasure of hearing him and it might even be that Waters has written a memorable work... I await more comments, maybe on Dave Gilmour's favorite puddings or the targeted marketing of rolling papers aimed at followers of post-psychedelic bands...... .

So, a couple of things for Barrett70. It’s true that there were some skirmishes between Ron Geesin and the orchestral musicians during the sessions for "Atom"; it's documented and historically verifiable. The point, however, is not whether the orchestral musicians knew how to play well or not; the fact is that because these (being good musicians from classical-traditional backgrounds) dismissed the supposed pretentiousness of Geesin's pseudo-psychedelic arrangements (arrangements, mind you, NOT compositions), they had no intention of “tiring themselves” with more “complex” scores than necessary, which ended up with mutual mockery and stress-related fatigue for Geesin, as you know. (Moreover, keep in mind that "that" type of orchestral musicians mainly cares about the money, before interpretation.) Regarding the parallel with Strauss playing the bass, I'll say that the idea itself is amusing, but no one asked or forced either of them to enter each other's musical territory. I mean, I really don’t believe that, under any circumstances, Mr. Strauss would have ventured into “light” music. Was it really that pressing for Waters to pursue lyricism? Let’s be clear, Barrett; I love the Floyd and also Waters, but let me say, as a musician, that Waters is quite a novice as a bassist (and he knows it). Furthermore, if you’ve seen the statements made in the DVD about the making of "Dark Side," it unfortunately becomes clear (at least to me and a couple of my friends) that his mental health has deteriorated significantly since the days of The Wall and Final Cut. Maybe Ca ira is even splendid, but his mind might be a bit less sharp. We’ll see. Regards :)

I am pleased to notice that you are exploring unfamiliar territories to me, and I must confess, this intrigues me because of your very visceral and "romantic" way of dealing with sound sensations and the transmission of emotions suggested by the lyrics. The only Oldham I knew (Andrew) was the talent scout from the sixties who produced the early Floyd, but it seems I need to "upgrade." By the way: are there really similarities with the beloved Drake? Hasta la victoria siempre :)

This is for MuSo: beautiful....what?

I’ll take a moment to connect with the last things written by Hobbit, which I understand have hit the nail on the head regarding the perception of things and... scores. I completely agree with what he stated, even on the level of taste and personal choices. What he listed are indeed essential moments of a "pop counterculture" that in those years shook up the simple rock'n'roll system to get heads moving, not just feet (paraphrasing what Fripp said), and to restructure and enrich a genre, rock, that needed to be reinvented in a cultured and "higher taste" way.
It would be interesting to discuss how and why prog floundered and self-destructed due to the punk wave in '77/'78. Zappa said that punk was an artfully created phenomenon by record companies; for me, aside from a few amusing, curious, and quirky episodes, it was simply trash. However, it was probably useful to "force" musically-minded heads to stretch their brains in search of new directions, which of course eventually emerged.
It would also be interesting to hear opinions on the more or less recent reunions of "historic" bands or on the current activities of some of these "dinosaurs". Personally, just to mention one, I find what Steve Hackett is doing really stimulating, having kept a low profile in the '80s and partially in the first half of the '90s; he has recently come out (despite the inevitable baggage) with some truly interesting work.
While I have followed (including live) Yes, for example, it seems to me that it has taken on the characteristics of a colossal business without much soul by now. I would love to hear the opinions of the debaseristis involved at different levels on this subject.
For now, a big hello to Hobbit and Sylvian :) Take care of yourselves.

JohnofPatmos, let me say that I was truly enchanted by the beauty your verses have managed to stir within my emotional strings. There, where the word becomes lyrical, meeting the fluidity of the music that generates and envelops it. "Beauty is a rare thing," as something by Ornette Coleman used to say, and you have captured the moment of beauty, truly remarkable in this work, describing it with genuine love. It’s not just telepathy, I believe: probably in this bend of time we were destined to read each other in the heart, in the eyes. Great derecensione, John, nothing like Labeque! Hasta siempre!! :))

Hal, Hal, you little tempting devil..... and you know who to tempt...... try using the satanic trident; maybe I'll sleep on it....
I also tried with Molvaer, here, in the area. It won't be an easy thing here either, for the moment. The work is currently available only in import circuits, (even though it’s Universal). In the meantime, I re-invite JohnOfPatmos to inform me about his derecension, as soon as it's available.
Hasta la vista :)